atom feed29 messages in org.apache.communityRe: At what point do you unsubscribe/...
FromSent OnAttachments
Jean T. AndersonDec 16, 2005 5:17 pm 
Noel J. BergmanDec 16, 2005 6:07 pm 
Roy T. FieldingDec 16, 2005 6:09 pm 
Jean T. AndersonDec 16, 2005 6:28 pm 
Noel J. BergmanDec 16, 2005 7:16 pm 
Roy T. FieldingDec 16, 2005 7:22 pm 
Noel J. BergmanDec 16, 2005 7:38 pm 
Martin CooperDec 16, 2005 8:03 pm 
Henri YandellDec 16, 2005 9:26 pm 
Antonio GallardoDec 16, 2005 9:37 pm 
Mark ThomasDec 17, 2005 2:33 am 
robert burrell donkinDec 17, 2005 7:01 am 
Stefano MazzocchiDec 17, 2005 7:10 am 
Noel J. BergmanDec 17, 2005 8:26 am 
Jean T. AndersonDec 17, 2005 9:07 am 
Mark ThomasDec 17, 2005 9:08 am 
Jean T. AndersonDec 17, 2005 9:14 am 
Thorsten ScherlerDec 17, 2005 9:49 am 
Mark ThomasDec 18, 2005 11:40 am 
robert burrell donkinDec 18, 2005 12:25 pm 
Sylvain WallezDec 20, 2005 3:50 am 
Jean T. AndersonDec 20, 2005 8:34 am 
Ted HustedJan 1, 2006 4:55 am 
Davanum SrinivasJan 3, 2006 6:17 am 
Will Glass-HusainJan 3, 2006 4:05 pm 
Ted HustedJan 4, 2006 7:35 am 
robert burrell donkinJan 5, 2006 1:10 pm 
Ted HustedJan 5, 2006 4:08 pm 
robert burrell donkinJan 9, 2006 2:12 pm 
Subject:Re: At what point do you unsubscribe/deny a misbehaving user?
From:Jean T. Anderson (jt@apache.org)
Date:Dec 16, 2005 6:28:40 pm
List:org.apache.community

Roy T. Fielding wrote:

On Dec 16, 2005, at 5:17 PM, Jean T. Anderson wrote:

derb@db.apache.org has been grappling with someone who delights in belittling other posters on the list. The topic was raised on women@ (see the thread starting with http://mail- archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/www-women/200511.mbox/%3c4371355F. 905@debrunners.com%3e ), but I think it's more appropriate for this list.

For crying out loud, would you please supply links to the exact posts you consider to be in poor taste and the person's name? I just wasted 10 minutes trying to follow the bread crumbs. You have to make it easier on reviewers -- everyone seems to be painfully avoiding a pointer to an actual message.

sorry -- I'm not trying to frustrate folks. I considered posting specific links, but withdrew them at the end, even though they are links to public archives. The name at the core is Michael Segel.

Below are links to public responses to some of his posts (which are numerous enough that they alone would be frustrating to wade through):


http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200508.mbox/%3C430DECF5.2070609@bristowhill.com%3E
http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200510.mbox/%3c43622C54.8030502@sun.com%3e
http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200511.mbox/%3C2EDE6E68-7660-467A-92F4-BC4858E44A3F@sun.com%3E
http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c439D9A71.4060905@bristowhill.com%3e
http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c439DC2A5.3010703@sun.com%3e

The first two posts were disassociated from the offending message and the tactic clearly didn't work.

The last two were recent (this week). Off line communication makes me believe he has no intention of moderating his behavior, hence the question of at what point you unsubscribe/deny a user.

In general, it is the responsibility of the PMC to govern its own lists. If the PMC decides to boot them, then go ahead. Most groups just shun the user.

One of the DB PMC members was asking about frequency of denial, which is an excellent question, which Noel responded to with "Rarely. Really really rarely." It's helpful for us to know how other projects at the ASF handle such situations. I'm getting questions from users asking why we don't just boot him. I'm happy to respond with "The ASF doesn't like to do that except for the most extreme cases" if that is the right answer. This case is merely very annoying, not extreme.

I think ignoring is an excellent tactic for a developer's list. I worry that isn't strong enough for a user's list, but I also wouldn't want to embark on a path that could backfire.

-jean