atom feed46 messages in org.apache.cocoon.devRe: Differences between Cocoon 2.1 an...
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Reinhard PötzAug 6, 2008 4:19 am 
Felix KnechtAug 6, 2008 4:28 am 
Andrew SavoryAug 6, 2008 4:30 am 
Daniel FagerstromAug 6, 2008 4:39 am 
Thorsten ScherlerAug 6, 2008 4:54 am 
Carsten ZiegelerAug 6, 2008 4:56 am 
Jasha JoachimsthalAug 6, 2008 6:15 am 
Peter HunsbergerAug 6, 2008 7:30 am 
Ralph GoersAug 6, 2008 7:43 am 
Joerg HeinickeAug 6, 2008 8:09 am 
Vadim GritsenkoAug 7, 2008 5:23 am 
Bertrand DelacretazAug 8, 2008 7:06 am 
Alfred NathanielAug 8, 2008 4:23 pm 
Reinhard PötzAug 10, 2008 1:15 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 10, 2008 1:19 am 
Vadim GritsenkoAug 10, 2008 12:08 pm 
Reinhard PötzAug 10, 2008 1:18 pm 
Vadim GritsenkoAug 10, 2008 3:46 pm 
Reinhard PötzAug 16, 2008 7:19 am 
Ralph GoersAug 16, 2008 7:32 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 17, 2008 7:44 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 17, 2008 8:14 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 17, 2008 10:41 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 18, 2008 2:23 am 
Rainer PruyAug 18, 2008 2:43 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 18, 2008 3:04 am 
Jeremy QuinnAug 18, 2008 3:42 am 
Jeremy QuinnAug 18, 2008 4:07 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 18, 2008 4:21 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 18, 2008 5:12 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 18, 2008 5:13 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 18, 2008 5:47 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 18, 2008 6:22 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 18, 2008 6:23 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 18, 2008 6:28 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 18, 2008 6:29 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 18, 2008 8:04 am 
Ralph GoersAug 18, 2008 8:21 am 
Carsten ZiegelerAug 18, 2008 8:41 am 
Jeremy QuinnAug 18, 2008 8:56 am 
Sylvain WallezAug 18, 2008 8:57 am 
Grzegorz KossakowskiAug 19, 2008 4:53 am 
Jeremy QuinnAug 19, 2008 8:03 am 
Jeremy QuinnAug 19, 2008 8:10 am 
Reinhard PötzAug 20, 2008 5:44 am 
Peter HunsbergerAug 20, 2008 7:32 am 
Subject:Re: Differences between Cocoon 2.1 and 2.2 (was: Re: Renaming Corona to Cocoon 3.0 and infrastructure)
From:Jeremy Quinn (jer@apache.org)
Date:Aug 19, 2008 8:03:53 am
List:org.apache.cocoon.dev

Hi Grzegorz,

Many thanks for your response : )

On 19 Aug 2008, at 12:54, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote:

Hi Jeremy,

Jeremy Quinn pisze:

From the PoV of users, it should also be clear : If you want or have to use Ant, use 2.1 If you want or have to use Maven, use 2.2 If you just need the Pipeline API, use 3.0

I'm not sure if I get you here correctly so I'll ask: Do you express your own wish or your own perception of situation we have when it comes to differences between 2.1 and 2.2?

I am trying to think about this from a 'marketing' perspective.

It would be typical to assume (IMHO) that 3.0 is somehow better than 2.2 which is somehow better than 2.1, just because of the version numbers.

Whereas from the point of view of a User, making projects (using SiteMaps, XML, XSLT, JXTemplate, FlowScript, etc. etc.) 2.1 and 2.2 are as much as possible, completely compatible and mostly just as capable as each other.

The fact that once a User has a suitable build, it makes very little difference whether they use 2.1 or 2.2 (not sure about 3.0) is something that I think we should put across more clearly.

It would be a shame to loose potential Users, because they perceived that the version that used their preferred build-technology, was in some way obsolete (which could now happen with both 2.1 and 2.2).

Maybe a capability matrix of some sort, would help a User trying to decide which version to use, would provide more reassurance that the 3 versions (or at least 2.1 and 2.2) would provide a viable, stable, long-lasting platform, even though the version numbers may say otherwise.

There should be no other difference in quality between the release versions, and none should be implied.

I'm afraid that it's not a case for some time at least according to my understand of Cocoon 2.2.

The build and distribution system for 2.2 is clearly more modern and sophisticated. It has a polymorphic block paradigm that suits the build technology, it has the powerful concept of virtual pipelines etc. etc.

And this is all great !

But from the Users' PoV of making projects, I cannot imagine a project that could be made successfully with 2.2 that could not be made using 2.1 (don't know enough about 3.0).

My assumption is that you personally find 2.2 more powerful because you prefer the build technology, not because 2.2 is intrinsically more powerful, or less buggy.

This is why I propose that we should give a clear message that all release versions are valid choices, primarily dependant on the build- technology that you prefer, not on specific version numbers.

AFAIU, TomCat is in a similar situation, where the different primary versions, represent not quality, but the version of the ServletAPI and JSP Spec they support. see: http://tomcat.apache.org/whichversion.html

I hope this is clearer

best regards

Jeremy