atom feed151 messages in org.w3.public-lodRe: Is 303 really necessary?
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Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 7:22 am 
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Leigh DoddsNov 4, 2010 8:38 am 
William WaitesNov 4, 2010 8:43 am 
Giovanni TummarelloNov 4, 2010 8:50 am 
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Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 8:55 am 
Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 8:57 am 
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Bradley AllenNov 4, 2010 9:06 am 
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Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 9:16 am 
bill...@planet.nlNov 4, 2010 9:20 am 
Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 9:22 am 
Bradley AllenNov 4, 2010 9:25 am 
Harry HalpinNov 4, 2010 9:33 am 
Robin YANGNov 4, 2010 9:51 am 
Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 9:54 am 
David WoodNov 4, 2010 9:56 am 
Mike KellyNov 4, 2010 10:12 am 
Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 10:13 am 
Patrick DurusauNov 4, 2010 10:17 am 
David WoodNov 4, 2010 10:24 am 
Patrick DurusauNov 4, 2010 10:36 am 
NathanNov 4, 2010 10:51 am 
Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 11:06 am 
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Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 11:18 am 
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Robert FullerNov 4, 2010 11:38 am 
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Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 11:41 am 
Jörn HeesNov 4, 2010 11:45 am 
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Robert FullerNov 4, 2010 11:48 am 
Ian DavisNov 4, 2010 11:58 am 
Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 12:00 pm 
Harry HalpinNov 4, 2010 12:03 pm 
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Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 12:12 pm 
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Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 12:14 pm 
NathanNov 4, 2010 12:26 pm 
Kingsley IdehenNov 4, 2010 12:36 pm 
99 later messages
Subject:Re: Is 303 really necessary?
From:Ian Davis (me@iandavis.com)
Date:Nov 4, 2010 10:13:52 am
List:org.w3.public-lod

Hi Dave,

On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 4:56 PM, David Wood <dav@3roundstones.com> wrote:

Hi all,

This is a horrible idea, for the following reasons (in my opinion and suitably
caveated):

- Some small number of people and organizations need to provide back-links on
the Web since the Web doesn't have them.  303s provide a generic mechanism for
that to occur.  URL curation is a useful and proper activity on the Web, again
in my opinion.

The relationship between 303 redirection and backlinks isn't clear to me. Can you expand?

- Overloading the use of 200 (OK) for metadata creates an additional ambiguity
in that the address of a resource is now conflated with the address of a
resource described by metadata.

My post addresses that case. I don't encourage people to use the same URI for both the metadata and the thing but to link them using a new predicate ex:isDescribedBy. I also say that you should believe the data. If the data says the thing you dereferenced is a document then that's what you should assume it is. If it says it's a toucan then that's what it is.

- W3C TAG findings such as http-range-14 are really very difficult to overcome
socially.

Maybe so, but I don't think that should stop 5 years of deployment experience from informing a change of practice. This isn't really relevant to my main question though: what breaks on the web.

- Wide-spread mishandling of HTTP content negotiation makes it difficult if not
impossible to rely upon.  Until we can get browser vendors and server vendors to
handle content negotiation in a reasonable way, reliance on it is not a
realistic option.  That means that there needs to be an out-of-band mechanism to
disambiguate physical, virtual and conceptual resources on the Web.  303s plus
http-range-14 provide enough flexibility to do that; I'm not convinced that
overloading 200 does.

My proposal isn't dependent on conneg. You can use it with the same caveats as anywhere else. But the simple case is just to serve up some RDF at the URI being dereferenced. BTW, conneg is very widely deployed in the Linked Data web and doesn't seem to have been a problem.

/me ducks for the inevitable mud slinging this list has become.

We can improve the quality of discussion on this list.

Ian