|Morten Wartou||Jan 3, 2002 5:59 am|
|Toni Mattila||Jan 3, 2002 6:21 am|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 3, 2002 6:32 am|
|Toni Mattila||Jan 3, 2002 6:34 am|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 3, 2002 2:39 pm|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 3, 2002 2:39 pm|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 3, 2002 3:22 pm|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 3, 2002 3:23 pm|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 3, 2002 3:30 pm|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 3, 2002 3:31 pm|
|David||Jan 3, 2002 3:32 pm|
|Juha Saarinen||Jan 3, 2002 3:37 pm|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 3, 2002 4:11 pm|
|Juha Saarinen||Jan 3, 2002 4:15 pm|
|Joe Croft||Jan 3, 2002 5:20 pm|
|Michael Carmack||Jan 3, 2002 5:44 pm|
|Greg Owen||Jan 3, 2002 6:29 pm|
|Peter C. Norton||Jan 3, 2002 7:13 pm|
|Michael Carmack||Jan 3, 2002 7:48 pm|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 3, 2002 8:48 pm|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 4, 2002 12:32 am|
|Zon Hisham Z.Abidin||Jan 4, 2002 12:57 am|
|Francois PHILIPPO||Jan 4, 2002 1:27 am|
|MH - Entwicklung||Jan 4, 2002 3:05 am|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 4, 2002 5:09 am|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 4, 2002 5:10 am|
|Roger Thomas||Jan 4, 2002 5:58 am|
|Morten Wartou||Jan 4, 2002 6:13 am|
|MH - Entwicklung||Jan 4, 2002 9:26 am|
|Tony Kueh||Jan 4, 2002 11:05 am|
|Robert L Mathews||Jan 4, 2002 11:09 am|
|Peter C. Norton||Jan 4, 2002 11:51 am|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 4, 2002 6:20 pm|
|Sam Varshavchik||Jan 4, 2002 6:21 pm|
|MH - Entwicklung||Jan 7, 2002 1:13 am|
|Subject:||Re: [courier-users] Add Buy.com to list of 8-bit header offenders|
|From:||Michael Carmack (kar...@karmak.org)|
|Date:||Jan 3, 2002 5:44:42 pm|
On Thu, Jan 03, 2002 at 05:04:45PM -0600, David wrote:
I sent them a stern email letting them know that messages formatted in such a fashion are not reaching their destination in the intended form, but I doubt it will make any difference...
Sam, I admire your dedication to remaining true to the RFC's and I think the net would be a better place if others took your stance, but this problem is beginning to be epidemic... we have heard reports now of lets see... E-bay, hotmail ?, buy.com, what others?
Might it be time to start making accepting or correcting the default mode rather than the even the current encapsulation method?
As it is, the senders don't care, but the users of your software are being hurt/annoyed/pestered.
Again, I think your in the right, and accept that since its your code you can do as you will, but please keep considering the flexibility issue.
I would like to cast my vote against this proposal. Not only do I admire Sam's dedication to the RFC's, I also support it. As you (David) say yourself: The net would be a better place if others took [Sam's] stance. So then what are you proposing? That Sam do his part to make the net a _worse_ place?
Sometimes change has to begin at the individual level. And sometimes that means not bowing to the arrogance and inconsideration of a few corporate monoliths that have no desire to be bothered with the petty concerns of us peasants.
Have a problem with the way Courier sends mail? Well, send a message to the developer himself and you'll get a personal reply addressing the problem. Have a problem with the way Buy.com sends mail? Well, good luck...
I know who _I'll_ stand behind.
If we don't have a set of standards that we can fall back on, what happens to us? Though it solves a problem in the short-term, such random protocol bastardization can only hurt us in the long run. If the protocol needs to be changed, then petition to get it changed. But to start slashing and hacking at the code to keep up with the whims of a few powerful corporations is folly.
Also, I think many open-source developers take a lot of artistic pride in their work, as opposed to commercial developers where the primary goal is to make money. The former are the ones who create works of art; the ones who at the end of the day stand back and admire what they've accomplished. The latter are the ones who do whatever it takes to please the most number of people and generate the most sales.
IMO, asking Sam to "fix" Courier (understand, you're really asking him to break it) because it's not what you think the public wants is akin to asking Picasso to give up the Cubism thing because the no-one understands it. If you want commodity art, then perhaps it's time to seek out the mail-server equivalent of Elvis plates and Britney Spears.
BTW, I don't mean for any of this to sound like a flame. It's just my honest take on the issue, and I thought a counter-opinion needed to be voiced.