62 messages in org.codehaus.groovy.devRe: [groovy-dev] Groovy performance: ...
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Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 2:09 am 
Steven DevijverFeb 19, 2008 2:37 am 
Alexandru Popescu ☀Feb 19, 2008 2:57 am 
Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 3:03 am 
Patric BechtelFeb 19, 2008 3:12 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 19, 2008 3:25 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 19, 2008 3:26 am 
Patric BechtelFeb 19, 2008 5:05 am 
Gavin GroverFeb 19, 2008 5:51 am 
Steven DevijverFeb 19, 2008 5:52 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 19, 2008 5:54 am 
Tom NicholsFeb 19, 2008 6:26 am 
Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 6:28 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 19, 2008 6:35 am 
Tom NicholsFeb 19, 2008 7:03 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 19, 2008 7:38 am 
Chanwit KaewkasiFeb 19, 2008 7:52 am 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 19, 2008 8:49 am 
Steven DevijverFeb 19, 2008 10:03 am 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 19, 2008 11:38 am 
Steven DevijverFeb 19, 2008 12:11 pm 
Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 12:39 pm 
Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 12:48 pm 
tugwilsonFeb 19, 2008 1:36 pm 
Alex TkachmanFeb 19, 2008 8:51 pm 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 20, 2008 2:10 am 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 20, 2008 9:46 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 20, 2008 5:25 pm 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 21, 2008 1:35 am 
Tom NicholsFeb 21, 2008 4:15 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 21, 2008 5:44 am 
Tom NicholsFeb 21, 2008 6:22 am 
Smith, Jason, CTR, OASD(HA)/TMAFeb 21, 2008 6:34 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 21, 2008 6:43 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 21, 2008 6:48 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 21, 2008 7:04 am 
Smith, Jason, CTR, OASD(HA)/TMAFeb 21, 2008 7:18 am 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 21, 2008 7:38 am 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 21, 2008 7:42 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 21, 2008 8:36 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 21, 2008 8:48 am 
Pascal DeMillyFeb 21, 2008 5:35 pm 
Gavin GroverFeb 21, 2008 6:21 pm 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 22, 2008 4:31 am 
Tom NicholsFeb 22, 2008 4:49 am 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 22, 2008 11:43 pm 
Guillaume LaforgeFeb 23, 2008 12:28 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 23, 2008 3:51 am 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 23, 2008 2:49 pm 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 23, 2008 2:53 pm 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 24, 2008 2:01 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 24, 2008 3:56 am 
Martin C. MartinFeb 24, 2008 4:11 am 
Charles Oliver NutterFeb 24, 2008 5:12 am 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 24, 2008 3:17 pm 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 24, 2008 3:31 pm 
Alexandru Popescu ☀Feb 24, 2008 3:36 pm 
Martin C. MartinFeb 26, 2008 2:20 pm 
Martin C. MartinFeb 26, 2008 3:15 pm 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 27, 2008 2:38 am 
Jochen TheodorouFeb 27, 2008 3:03 am 
Martin C. MartinMar 2, 2008 5:21 pm 
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Subject:Re: [groovy-dev] Groovy performance: what to doActions...
From:Martin C. Martin (mar@martincmartin.com)
Date:Feb 24, 2008 3:56:13 am
List:org.codehaus.groovy.dev

Charles Oliver Nutter wrote:

Excellent summary of the problems with this proposal. I have some comments below.

Jochen Theodorou wrote:

Groovy has atm dynamic typing. Any change with a fast mode goals a more or less static system, which is a major change for such a language. There is either version 2, which will mean you can not mix dynamic typed parts and static typed parts in the same area and there is version 3 which allows that, but will also give not many hints when it will do static and when it will do dynamic typing.

This is exactly what worried me. Because static typing goes through an entirely different mechanism, it would be both confusing and problematic for users. This is further complicated by the many users that would try to take their Groovy code and "make it faster" by adding static types. Suddenly dispatch rules would be completely different, and the code would break.

Actually, we have static typing in Groovy:

def foo (String s) {1} def foo (Object o) {2}

String a = "test" Object b = a def c = a def d = b

// with Groovy style static typing assert foo(a) == 1 assert foo((Object)b) == 2 assert foo(c) == 2 assert foo((Object)d) == 2

Which suggests two questions:

1. Since this has been in there for a while and hasn't caused problems in existing code bases, would allowing a different syntax for the same thing cause problems? Right now we can say "in this particular use, treat variable X as class C, even if it's of a class derived from C." The proposed change would say "wherever this variable is used, treat it as class C." That means the declaration which determines the semantics is removed from where its used, but that's no different from any other declaration. For example, "a = 23" can fail if a is of type, say, Map. And that declaration could be far away from the assignment line, but people seem to handle that alright.

2. Could we use the existing syntax to do more at compile time and less at runtime? I think the answer at the moment is "no," because the types are just given to the metaclass, and in general its an uncomputable problem to tell what the metaclass will be at compile time.

But what if the programmer could annotate a class to say "all instances of a given class use the same metaclass," and then have a way for the metaclass to tell the compiler when a method could be determined at compile time?

For example, if the Metaclass has a resolveMethod() method, then at compile time we could instantiate the Metaclass with a no-arg constructor and call resolveMethod() with the given types. If it returns a method, we could insert that call directly. If it returns None, we go back to inserting the normal ScriptBytecodeAdapter.invokeMethod() call.

What do people think?

Best, Martin

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