21 messages in net.sourceforge.lists.courier-usersRe: [courier-users] Enhanced Maildir ...
FromSent OnAttachments
Marc HaberJan 9, 2001 4:43 am 
Kris KelleyJan 9, 2001 9:14 am 
Georg LutzJan 9, 2001 2:20 pm 
Chris GreenJan 10, 2001 12:37 am 
Georg LutzJan 10, 2001 1:49 pm 
Marc HaberJan 12, 2001 9:34 am 
Marc HaberJan 12, 2001 9:36 am 
Chris MeadorsJan 12, 2001 10:07 am 
Georg LutzJan 13, 2001 6:10 am 
Georg LutzJan 13, 2001 6:46 am 
Marc HaberJan 13, 2001 1:45 pm 
jhen...@bogon.comJan 14, 2001 12:00 pm 
Mirko ZeibigJan 14, 2001 2:21 pm 
Patrick PriceJan 14, 2001 3:17 pm 
Patrick PriceJan 14, 2001 5:51 pm 
Cindy SmithJan 14, 2001 6:26 pm 
Patrick PriceJan 14, 2001 8:26 pm 
Patrick PriceJan 14, 2001 8:37 pm 
Marc HaberJan 15, 2001 12:11 am 
Marc HaberJan 22, 2001 2:47 am 
Marc HaberJan 22, 2001 2:48 am 
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Subject:Re: [courier-users] Enhanced Maildir Specification where?Actions...
From:Marc Haber (cour@marc-haber.de)
Date:Jan 12, 2001 9:34:55 am
List:net.sourceforge.lists.courier-users

On Tue, 9 Jan 2001 11:14:44 -0600, "Kris Kelley" <kkel@genericapp.com> wrote:

Since the search engines don't show anything when I search for "enhanced maildir" (bringing up only references to maildirmake's man page), I have to ask here. Is the "enhanced maildir" a standard, which software besides courier supports it?

http://www.inter7.com/courierimap/README.maildirquota.html contains an explanation of how the enhanced maildir standard, or "Maildir++", differs from the original maildir standard.

Is there any other software besides Courier that uses Maildir++?

I haven't used mutt, so I may be off-base, but if it conforms to the original Maildir standard, then you shouldn't have any problems.

Well, mutt treats maildirs and mailboxes the same, and when it recognizes a subdirectory as a maildir, it opens it as a maildir. And it doesn't display directories starting with a period, so directly accessing a maildir++ is kind of uncomfortable.

The only inconvenience would be you that you can't access email in folders you created using your IMAP client. Now if the makers of mutt came up with their own way of doing subfolders that doesn't conform to Maildir++, then you're going to have incompatability issues, in that mail moved by mutt can't be read by your IMAP client, and vice versa.

I do not know if the makers of mutt specially intended to support folders and subfolders. I just have made subdirectories where multiple mail dirs are stored. That way, I can only store actual messages in leaves of my directory tree, but it works fine. However, I only see my indir in courier-imap.

An example here: haber@janet[5/505]:~$ tree -d .mail .mail |-- abuse | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp |-- cron-intern | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp |-- debian | |-- bugs | | |-- cur | | |-- new | | `-- tmp | |-- hardware | | |-- cur | | |-- new | | `-- tmp | `-- packages | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp |-- einkauf | |-- hardware | | |-- cur | | |-- new | | `-- tmp | |-- misc | | |-- cur | | |-- new | | `-- tmp |-- fw-logs | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp |-- indir | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp |-- info | |-- bugs | | |-- cur | | |-- new | | `-- tmp | `-- politik | |-- cur | |-- new | `-- tmp <snip>

.mail/indir is where my mail is delivered to.

The requirements to - have all folders below inbox...

Because of the way Maildir++ defines its heirarchy, and because of the way Courier IMAP differentiates between private and shared mail folders, this is really just an illusion. The inbox is the top-level cur directory; all other mail folders are independent of it. If you use an IMAP client that supports the CAPABILITY command (see http://www.inter7.com/courierimap/FAQ.html#namespace), this becomes more obvious.

Does Netscape 4.75 support this? I don't have really a clue about IMAP since I have always read my mail on a local spool (or using POP3 with a Windows client :-( ) - this is the first time I try IMAP since our customers (and my dedicated colleagues) demand it.

- have all folders start with a period...

Probably because the period is the heirarchy separator.

I still fail to see why subdirectories are not used for this.

- implement subfolders with a file name kludge instead of using the host OS directories...

I believe this was done so that a single directory could be scanned for all relevant mail folders, making it unnecessary to recursively search a directory tree.

But if a lot of folders are used, this could be a serious performance penalty since some file systems (for example ext2 on Linux) don't perform too good on a full directory.

My impression is that Courier and its associated programs were designed with remote email services in mind.

Yes, I concur. However, what the Open Source world seriously needs is a mail system that fits all, local access, remote services using current (IMAP; POP/SASL) and obsolete (POP/APOP or even plain POP) protocols.

If this is really an issue for you, your best recourse may be to keep all email in a single folder (cur, the "inbox") that can be read by any Maildir or Maildir++ compatable program.

Yuck. Then I wouldn't need to use IMAP.

Greetings Marc

-- -------------------------------------- !! No courtesy copies, please !! ----- Marc Haber | " Questions are the | Mailadresse im Header Karlsruhe, Germany | Beginning of Wisdom " | Fon: *49 721 966 32 15 Nordisch by Nature | Lt. Worf, TNG "Rightful Heir" | Fax: *49 721 966 31 29